2003 MG TF 135 for parts / repair LOTS OF GOODIES

doramatadora wrote:

.......... said it was running very rich but that the car seemed fine otherwise, and they thought it was probably the fuel (E10).............<<<snip>>>

....... Garage also told me it would cost for them to take the ECU out, .........

E10 won't make the engine run rich, the ECU will adjust fuelling based on what it sees from the lambda probe.

The ECU is held in with 2 x 8mm nuts and 2 electric plugs. it is accessible from the boot. If I was authorising the garage to arrange the ECU company to work on it at the prices quoted I would expect them to take it out FOC, I know my 2 regular garages would.

Maybe the garage could get the car back to you.

I wouldn't normally do this but it might be worth contacting Rob Bell on the MGF Register forum as he isn't far from you and has a pscan.

I would offer to help but I have daughters getting married and trips to see my mother in law so time is short.

Good luck, it is something simple, it's just finding it.

James

Thinking about it - I would start by checking live data to see what the ECU coolant temp sensor is reading. If that is faulty the ECU guesses the temperature of the engine and over fuels.

I had a very busy day so couldn’t get back to you earlier. Back at work now (night shift) so I have plenty of time to go through the workshop manual 😆

I must point out that the factory manual for these things is an appallingly written technical document as are all of ‘em these days.
It would seem they hand the job to some poor bastard just out of university without any practical experience.

Yes I agree with James the ECU coolant temp sensor is a likely culprit, there are 2 coolant temp sensors one for the ECU and one for the temp gauge, make sure someone hasn’t put the plugs on these arse about. And of course the sensor will need checking.

There is also an air intake temp sensor, if this is buggered then it would effect the calibration of the ECU.

Another sensor that could be a problem is the MAP sensor (manifold absolute pressure) when these things shit themselves they’ll make the engine run like a hairy goat. There are 2 “O” rings on these and if they’re stuffed then that could be a vacuum leak.

Heated oxygen sensors ( 2 of… one before the cat converter and one after) if these are ratshit then they will effect the running.

Another thing I’d look at is the fuel pressure regulator, if it isn’t behaving it might not let enough surplus fuel return back to the tank causing over fuelling. Make sure the vacuum hose is attached properly and the hose isn’t leaking.

The max fuel pump pressure should be 3.5 bar @ 13.5 volts.
The regulated injection pressure should be 3.0 bar with a tolerance of +/- 0.2 bar.
The fuel pump delivery rate should be 39 litres @ 3.0 bar ( I assume this is to be measured over 1 minute, the workshop manual doesn’t bother troubling us with this detail )
The sensor values are:
Total Track resistance: 4k +/- 20%
Sensor supply: 5 volts +/- 4%

That’s probably enough to be going on with for now

Cobber is right, as he usually is. Either your garage do not know fxxk all about motor cars, which is likely or they have somebody lined up for yours. It runs. That means that with the correct diagnostic tool, it will tell somebody who knows how to diagnose it's readings exactly what is wrong with it. Saying it is due to E10 is just fraud and you have been hadand ripped off by these masturbating monkeys. That is not the fault of the car, nor you. Get it back and find somebody more able. That is far too good a car to break and you will regret doing so.

Friends – I can't thank you enough!

Cobber – I nearly spat out my coffee at "when these things shit themselves they’ll make the engine run like a hairy goat". We have whisk(e)y at home, it's such a shame about the ocean. You're a legend.

I have sourced a PDF of the workshop manual for now, and arranged to pick up the car + tow on Saturday... FINALLY! :hgf: I don't feel so defeated anymore, thanks to you all, especially James and Cobber. I've a clear list of things to check now, and just need to find the right person to go through it (and save up a bit). We are going away for a week, but I'm so much happier knowing that my little car will be safe at home. Still in disbelief that somebody managed to drive into it at the garage.

I did ask the garage to check the HO2Ss and was told "that's got nothing to do with anything". Grr. I didn't know to suggest the coolant and intake temp sensors, or MAP sensor – and I guess I'd hoped the more qualified people would have thought of these things (of course they didn't).

minimax, I am mightily unimpressed with these hacks. I wanted to shout at them last time I was there, but just ended up sobbing a bit. On Saturday I'm going to ask them for a printout of all the "work" they did, and then leave an honest review.

I will have a look for Rob Bell over at MGF Register when we are back.

James, congratulations on your daughters' weddings! What a lovely way to be busy.

Much love, Dora

Thank you Dora, it's a long time coming and only really possible as they won a show case wedding at a local hotel.

I dunno….. being a crim has it’s perks 😉
We’ve all had moments when ya can’t get a fair suck of the sauce bottle!
Sometimes we just have to cop it sweet and move on.

Many a time I’ve felt that if it were raining young nubile nymphomanics, I’d get washed down the damned gutter with a bloody hideous fat old mother superior!
Maybe once the dust settles on this disaster and things are on the up, you might be able to have another go at a MGF / TF, at least then you’ll be armed with more knowledge and you’ll know where to find us in order to help out.

This is making grim reading as I am sure it's not illegal to tow a MOT failed car away from a garage as long as you can steer and stop the towed car . This garage you are using IS ripping you off . There must be a way of getting the car back to you so someone with the correct diagnostic skill can sort it ! I think we all feel for you .
John .

It’s not illegal to have the car moved to a different garage or to an off road location such as a friends.

I would speak to MG mobile mechanics, they are really good and fair, and will not rip you off.

I am in north London - Mark gave me the heads up on this thread!

Sorry about the problems - on these MEMS3 engines, the commonest cause of misfire and loss of power is from failing coil packs, and these would give the kind of errors that have been reported.

I have a pscan, so can do live data, if the problem has not been sorted by the time you get your beloved TF back home!

I am surprised by the ECU costs estimate. Used working ECUs sell for around 50 pounds. NOS factory ones around 100. Recurved ones (you would need to send in the old one) from places such as Kmaps or MGF centre sell for around 240. Swapping out ECUs is very easy. 4 screws, 2 plugs. The hardest part is just to disconnect the plugs, which can be a bit stiff.

If you could at least get a hold a a used one that could be verified as being in good working order, that might be worth a try on your own.